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Vol.23 : Thomas Wedgwood (Waterford Wedgwood Japan Limited)
August 1, 2007
Electronics sector seeing waves of shake-ups
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Seven & I adapts 'conbini' to America
Expanded coverage: Kadokawa joins Google in legit YouTube videos
humanity：人間性
abolishing the slave trade：奴隷取引を廃止すること
medallions：メダル型の宝飾品
creamware glaze：クリームウェアの釉薬
porcelain：磁器
celebrity endorsements：有名人によるお墨付き
anglophile：イギリスが好きな人
oxides：酸化物
bas reliefs：浅浮き彫り
stoneware：咋器（せっき）
（ T: Tom, P: Peter ）
| P : |
...You're the 8th generation of the Wedgwood family. |
| P : |
Dating back to your great, great, great, great, great, great, great... |
| T : |
Great grandfather in 1759.
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| T : |
Josiah Wedgwood, yes.
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| P : |
Okay. Tell us a little bit about Josiah because I have read a little bit about him and I have heard you speak about him and he is a very interesting character. |
| T : |
I think he was a very passionate person. First and foremost, he was passionate about humanity. He had a strong fondness for science. He had a strong fondness for business and pottery.
But I think a characteristic that is probably - that I hold dear and with Josiah is really in his passion for humanity, his passion to make the world a better place and especially in U.K. in the 18th century, no matter what he did in business or what he did as an artist, always his end objective was how can I make society a better place and...
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| P : |
He was in favor of abolishing the slave trade in the 18th century, wasn't he? |
| T : |
Absolutely and again this was quite remarkable as a businessman because it really didn't make much sense as a businessman then. A lot of things that Josiah did really went against the grain of his government at the time and of his patrons too, but he always stood fast in his beliefs.
And I think that, you know, that in itself, has been so integral into what our brand is today, you know. If we didn't have that sort of integrity of - or value, we probably wouldn't have lasted as long as we have...
But, yeah, you know, again Josiah - he really believed in fairness and even - going back when he was setting up his business, you know, he was one of the first people to set up a structured healthcare system, he was the first one to set standards...
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| T : |
...for employees, yes, which is - again in industrial England was very, very rare. And, you know, these are things that came from his personal beliefs and something like slave trade, you know, he looked at what resources that he would have to bring about the most amount of change and he used something - and at this time he was most noted for his jasper clay, and so it was very fashionable at the time, this was, you know, the neoclassical style was becoming very much predominant at that time period.
So he thought one of the best way I can bring awareness for the end of slavery is to make little jasper medallions, and again we could take something that's fashionable and really bring a strong message for change, yeah.
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| P : |
And he distributed those medallions to what kind of people? |
| T : |
He distributed to opinion leaders, to aristocrats, to politicians, and...
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| P : |
And they would wear the medallions? |
| T : |
...they would wear them or they would pin them on very much like we'd, you know, with AIDS we wear the ribbon on now with the bands that we wear.
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| T : |
This, I suppose, was one of the first times when it came - yeah, first time making a little badge to wear and he had a relationship with Benjamin Franklin, so he had sent these medallions over to Benjamin Franklin, again asked him can you pass these out to opinion leaders at the time or politicians and friends that you might know, yeah. |
| P : |
Okay. Let's get back to Wedgwood as a company. You talked about Josiah's jasper clay. |
| P : |
Was that the main innovation or what was the first big innovation with Wedgwood China? |
| T : |
It was actually a Queen's Ware - what we call 'Queen's Ware' today, which is a creamware glaze, and it's a bit interesting because in the - if you look at ceramic history, in the 18th century, most of ceramics was a copy of Chinese porcelain and there's a very distinct difference between the English pottery industry and Mainland European, where, you know, if you think of companies like Mycenae and what have you, a lot of them got their start by royal families going, you know, "This is gorgeous, this is beautiful stuff coming from China, let's make it." And it was - so the companies originated on patronages from the royal family.
And Josiah didn't want to do this. He thought there was an opportunity to create a uniquely English style. So he set about, well, how can we do something that feels as delicate as Chinese porcelain, but is completely different that is very much - belongs to us and he came up again using his science, a creamware pattern, and I think Josiah understood celebrity endorsements well before anyone else did because what he did is he took this and he sent it to Queen Charlotte, and Queen Charlotte fell in love with this creamware, and she goes, "Wow! This is something that's English. This is something that belongs to us."
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| T : |
And in the pottery industry in the U.K. everything was rather, you know, still stuck in baroque style and brown and - anyway Queen Charlotte fell in - not only did she fall in love with it, she also decided to rename it from what he was calling creamware to 'Queen's Ware' and made him Potter to Her Majesty. But the point is that we actually - we went out and through making a product that was unique; we were able to get the support of the royal family rather than having it outright.
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| T : |
And, you know, from that point on we've always had strong connection with royal families and his creamware - his first major success came with his creamware with a service made for Catherine the Great and...
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| T : |
Of Russia. And, you know, she was an anglophile and she was looking to make the largest dinner service in the world at that time with all hand-painted scenery of English countryside and most English potters wouldn't touch this. They thought there's an impossibility, there's no way you can make that - she was looking for roughly a 1,000 pieces or a 50-place setting - 50 person service.
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| P : |
Every single one hand painted... |
| T : |
Every single one hand painted with English countryside. And Josiah said, "No, we can do this." And in the process he set up a very efficient factory, you know, assembly line with hand painters, but he saw - he knew he wasn't going to make money on it, he saw it as a wonderful opportunity or sort of the perfect marketing tool. It was very nice to have the endorsement from Queen Charlotte, but if he can actually break into European market and have a dinner service with - along these lines of Catherine the Great.
So, he set up this assembly line, he decided that he would go to all the aristocrats, you know, in Georgian time people building these massive houses, and he went up to them, and he said, "Can I have the honor of painting your home on a plate for Catherine the Great. And, of course, everyone said, "Yeah, no, we would be delighted to."
And he finished the service, again, and ended up 944 pieces with 1,200 scenes of it - of England painted on it, finished it in about 9 months. Before he sent it to Catherine the Great, he put it on display in London, charged tickets for people to go and see this. And everyone was very excited. They wanted to go and see whose house was chosen, whose estate was chosen to be painted on this dinner service.
He got the aristocrats interested in his brand, interested in his products. And oddly enough, Queen Charlotte came strolling down to take a look at the service and she got quite jealous, you know, this is quite - this is much, much bigger than the tea service that you provided me.
And from that point on, we've - again we've established ourselves as being worthy of royalty with Catherine the Great and with UK royalty. But in the process of doing it, he set up such a efficient factory that he realized that he can actually manufacture this for the middle class - the upper middle class, which was growing, and he knew that's where he was going to make his money. Because we did - we almost lost money on the Catherine the Great service. But again the endorsement from it just, you know, it just absolutely boomed with the middle class afterwards. So that was his first major innovation.
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| P : |
Interesting.
At the risk of asking you a very stupid question, you mentioned jasper just now, I really don't know what jasper is, you're going to have to explain this for me.
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| T : |
All right. Jasper is probably Josiah's greatest invention or achievement. He invented a new ceramic body and what it is - It's actually a stoneware body and by putting different oxides into the clay, we can make the clay turn color throughout the entire body.
But the beauty of it is you can make what we call bas reliefs or motifs, and we have, you know, we cover it with modelers, and they make this bas reliefs and they attach it to the clay - to a body, for instance, if you are making a vase and they take these motifs and put them on when the clay is still, what we call, leather hard dried before it goes into the fire.
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| P : |
Are we taking about the blue Wedgwood that everybody knows now which I mistakenly thought was something else a moment ago? |
| T : |
That's right. That's right. That's right. Yeah and...
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| T : |
And, you know, it's funny when - again there will be a body of clay that looks rather gray when the artist is working with it. And I would love to tell you the formula, but I am not allowed to, it's a deeply-guarded secret because it has been - the clay has been completely unique to us for almost 220 years.
But what happens is when it goes to the fire, it would change color, so it changed to this pale blue and the relief were changed to a white, and that is just done, you know, again with porcelain you often use glazes to change color or you often paint it, but this was a stoneware body, which changed with just the - yeah, changed just with fire and...
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| P : |
Another stupid question, I am terribly sorry. Stoneware as opposed to porcelain. |
| T : |
It's more of a clay - it's a more of a clay ingredient in there.
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oriental flair：オリエンタルスタイル
brand literate：ブランドに精通している
bandwagon：流行に乗ろうと真似すること
bespoke：注文品の
（ T: Tom, P: Peter ）
| P : |
...I was in your flagship shop a while back, and looking at the different cups and saucers and plates and everything you have on display there, there are not only the very traditional designs everybody associates with Wedgwood immediately, there are also some much more modern things, and some things that even look a little bit Japanese...
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| P : |
Now I understand that you have actually tailored some of your designs for the Japanese market. |
| T : |
Sure, yes. Again, I think today, being part of a global brand, actually even if you look at styles or fashion in the UK at the moment, there is strong oriental flair, and so if we are to represent English style, we have to take into account what English style is today.
And, you know, we don't want to make something specifically just for Japan, but we wanted to maybe take some influence from other cultures and incorporate that into our own style. We have a tremendous task because we are a brand that's almost 250 years, how do we balance our tradition and how do we be innovative. And we were founded on the principle of a spirit of innovation, and again doing something uniquely English.
So, I think today one of the best things we can do is find maybe interesting parts of other cultures and incorporate those into our design.
...one of the reasons I have always been attracted to Japan is because if you look at business here whether it's - either branding or product development, there is so much to be learned. You know, I think if, you know, well, again relating to product development, if you can get it right in Japan, you'll probably be successful anywhere else in the world.
You know, Japan has the most demanding consumers out of everywhere I have experienced, which is something I like. You know, because it really sort of pushes the envelope when it comes to making sure, you know, your quality is spot on and, you know, there's a lot of people now interested in China with all the excitement going on there and I keep stressing to people, don't forget about Japan.
Actually, there's more of an opportunity in Japan now because, you know, Japanese consumer is, you know, they are much more brand literate and they are much more brand mature than most other regions of the world and you can't just rubbish that with branding things anymore.
You know, you have to - you know, you really have to have something behind a brand. So, again this - it's a great challenge for us, you know, and it sort of keeps us on an edge and it makes it very, very interesting.
For example, by contrast, you know, I spent quite a lot of time in China lately and our prestige level in China is growing very fast. We have a consumer, who will buy something just because it's the most expensive. In Japan, it's much more interesting because now, you know, that sort of bandwagon - in fact, you know, it's completely disappearing. You know people are looking for things that are unique; they look anything to make them more individualized and standout a bit more.
So for us, I think that is - it's very, very interesting. A greater challenge there is in Japan though is a lot of people with Japanese - a lot of people in Japan think of Britain maybe, you know, 200 years ago and how do we promote Britain as a very contemporary design culture, which it is at the moment, and so, you know, the more that happens then the more we can start introducing contemporary and saying, you know, this is very much in the spirit of English design. This is very much the spirit of Wedgwood, and again we are just walking this tight rope between innovation and...
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| T : |
...tradition, yeah and Japan gives us the best place in the world to do that, you know, I think because if we get all right here then it will be good for the rest of Asia, it will be good for Europe.
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| P : |
When you have a visionary starting whether it be a company or some other kind of an institution, it's easy enough or it maybe it's not that easy actually for that person themselves to keep the vision going while they were alive.
When they've died and somebody else takes the institution or the company over, you have somebody, who although they may be a direct descendent of that founder, they are going to have slightly different values, you know, everybody has it - slightly different sense of values. How difficult is it to maintain the original vision that Josiah Wedgwood had for the company?
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| T : |
Thank you Peter for putting - reminding me of what this pressure, you know, and I am the eight generation, if I mess it up on my watch. We left it up to the eighth to mess it up.
Yeah - no, it's funny, every family member has brought a different - had brought different aspects in and in a small way different identity to the company, but now I think our core values have never changed. I think it comes from a sense of pride from, you know, the previous generations, who've worked - I mean, yeah, who've worked - who've been involved with the company in its - and there is a tremendous amount of responsibility.
But at the same time, you know, if I look at my father's generation and my grandfather's generation, they worked with that same sort of passion that I imagined Josiah did and that, you know, every single generation, including Josiah have never forced their will or forced their desire or ambition for the next generation to take over.
It's been very organic in some sense, you know, and looking back at my grandfather and father's generation if, you know, you - as a child you saw this passion and no matter what you're interested in, either outside of business or outside of Wedgwood, you felt this kind of desire to keep perpetuating these values that they have had. So, yeah, I think although different influences perhaps when it comes to design, that actual core value of Wedgwood hasn't changed very much - hasn't changed.
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| P : |
What about the philanthropic side, are there activities going on at the moment? |
| T : |
Yeah, I think - yeah, very much so. We don't do anything on sort of a global level, but in each community and each market we try to be as active as we possibly can, you know. We have done some very nice events in Japan with refugees - international refugees and, you know, we are trying to also look for opportunities that are a bit unique...
...for instance, I think last year we had this wonderful auction at the British Embassy, hosted by the Brand Ambassador, and the idea was to get some English brands together and - for a big auction and everyone said 'Auctions don't work in Japan, you're not going to do very well with this.' No, you know, let's do it, try something different.
And we took a vase and I stood up and said, "Okay, I want you all to spend a lot of money for this black vase. But what you will get - is you will get something completely personalized and completely unique and completely bespoke," and it generated quite a lot of money, I think, 2.5 - 2 million - okay, 2 million and I think we've probably the second highest item that went in the auction.
And, yeah, so I look for things that - you know you can find - you can be a corporate and responsible at the same time. You know you can still bring a lot of decent purity to your brand. You know they can go just very nicely together.
In the UK, we did something very similar with - Prince Albert had painted this lovely picture that we decided we'd put on to a vase and we put this up for auction at Royal Gala there. We got 400,000 Pounds...
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| P : |
One of the things we always ask in these interviews is, are you a 'Nikkei Weekly' reader and... |
| T : |
Yeah - no, absolutely it's a funny - if I've been away for quite some time I always come back and it's a funny thing on my desk, isn't it, because there is a load of newspapers. And, you know, people usually expect me to go through and read, you know, three weeks of newspapers.
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| T : |
And, you know, I am never very consistent with the newspapers that I do read. But this is God, it's honest truth, every Monday I am going through and I am taking up 'The Nikkei Weekly,' and that is what I do - go through.
I thoroughly enjoy it. I enjoy the diversity. You know, it's one of the more dynamic newspapers for, well, English I suppose, you know, English-speaking environment to learn about Japanese business. I am always really intrigued with some of their articles.
I remember reading an article about a small Japanese company that all they do is make the screws for hard drives, you know, something - it's a topic that I would have never really picked up, but you know I remember it was an article in 'Nikkei Weekly' that just stood out, and I was fascinated, you know, I went just right through this article and said 'That's the company I would like to go and invest in.'
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| P : |
It must be very much indispensable. Yeah. |
| T : |
Yeah, and so it is the one publication and one newspaper that does stay on my desk, yeah.
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 Niall P. Murphy, Ph.D. / Unit Leader
Riken Brain Science Institute 
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